Attitudes need to change, guys.

You guys, we really need to clean up our act around here - as of late, I have been really sick with some of the postings. Examples? A user by the name of 3314 recently posted a deal on a small hard drive, and was subsequently torn apart for it. You know what? If you don't like the deal, then pass over it. His subject line was clear, and if it wasn't for you, no interest needed to be shown. Instead, people took the time to open up the message and respond rudely. Just because you don't need the drive doesn't mean others won't benefit from seeing it. Another example was the recent thread that was deleted regarding the identity of a user - regardless of whether or not that was true, there was so much hate and unpleasantness on both sides of that issue that it was almost frightening. Words like "retard, gay, and ******" were tossed around like insults as if we had all regressed to the 4th grade playground, and while people apologized, those words were still said. Let's just try to be a little more... decent? humane? nice? while we go about browsing the board, OK? Is that too much to ask? -Ben __________________ AMEN!! Totally agree here. Thank you for saying something. __________________ Agreed, lets not turn this into another AnandTech. We don't need a hateful community. __________________ this sounds SO awful based on the subject matter, but there really IS an off topic forum for this kind of stuff! You should know this Ben, not being a newbie. And you should KNOW that people like 3314 and Homie have been semi-spamming the forums with onedayfree deals. We're being protective, and trying to keep it clean... __________________ Yeah!! And by the way.... where can I buy a Playstation for $5.00??????? You really discourage newcomers from posting with all your "I'm too cool", and "Boy, I'm glad I'm not a newbie" attitudes!!! __________________ Didn't mean to offend you Ben, but these guys Homie and 3314 (probably the same person) have been posting what looks like a deal, but really it is just them advertising for their site. They post some product a couple times a week. My point being there is a specific forum called 'For Sale/Trade' that they should be using. __________________ AJ, I know that technically this does belong in the Off-Topic forum, but I considered the fact that it would go mostly unread by those that it was directed at was more important than protocol for the moment. I also understand the need to "keep the board clean" - I am at the moment technically attributing to its imperfection - but at the same time that cleanliness can be addressed in a kind and helpful manner. -Ben (ed: Fixed spelled error, that --> than) [This message has been edited by Ben_Williams (edited 07-11-2000).] __________________ I understand what Ben is saying. But, frankly, regarding the Vladik/consumeradvocate thing...I totally disagree. A lot of people felt very-much betrayed by what happened. Although, I didn't say anything, I also felt the same. You felt you had an important issue, and regardless of misplaced areas, you put it out there. And, that is your choice/right. But we also should have the freedom to speak our feelings. That is what makes this place, as good as it is. If not, I certainly wouldn't be here. if people are going to be thin-skinned...they should think about putting it out there. nothing is meant as hurtful(unless a clear boundary-violation has occurred...at least as far as I have seen). OK, long post...I'm out. [This message has been edited by Realrammstein (edited 07-10-2000).] __________________ Realrammstein, I'm not aiming my message at people such as you who clearly think things through and then post a message; and my intent was not to say that those message belonged elsewhere, because that would be hypocritical. What I'm asking to stop is the childish insults and rude comment that have become pervasive as of late. When people take issue to something, and sit down and write a carefully constructed reply such as yours, then I commend them, regardless of their stance. However, when people take issue to something and quickly jot down some silly and quickly constructed reply, I have to object. -Ben __________________ quote: Originally posted by Ben_Williams: AJ, I know that technically this does belong in the Off-Topic forum, but I considered the fact that it would go mostly unread by those that it was directed at was more important that protocol for the moment. Come on, man. You have a bunch of posts, your not new, you can't do that just to get attention. It will get moved there, and you lose respect for you post- it looks like you don't know what you're doing. If everyone felt their post was too important, like you, then the boards would be a mess... __________________ I think if a post gets out of hand it should be locked and moved to the off topic forum. Where it can be continued until everyone involved is satisfied. As for the comment you made about just skipping over the threads you don't like. Well you should take your own advice and skip over the threads that you do not think you want to read. I can't see how you can tell us to skip over threads while you aren't doing the same. __________________ The only peson i insult is sillyazn and he knows its all a joke we chill together on a daily basis..........but if i offended anyone sorry __________________ hahahahaha werd. only get offened wen they talkin bout u ben_williams __________________ Ben: I must also take exception with some of your remarks. I, myself, have made some very off-colour remarks in haste, and was appropriately taken to task by Ugly and friends; many a time, what can be construed as something mean-spirited or "hateful" (a word bandied about all too often on these boards, along with "scam"!) is either a) a joke in poor taste or b) a sometimes misguided, sometimes not, attempt to protect these very boards we all love. In fact, some of my "retard" posts were in that very vein: people using e-bay style caps lock titles for deal requests. Hey, let's admit I didn't exaclty use the best terminology for the people I was targeting...but it rankled me, and I have just as much right to express that emotion as you have to not read it. __________________ quote: Originally posted by pennypinch: I'll agree with an above post: I was sincerely offended by some of the things that were written in the deleted argument with Vadimr; I hope I didn't do anything too bad in that argument... pennypinch, you and I were pretty much alone during that argument towards the end (except voodu, but, according to Vadimr, he was my alias). We rightfully assulted him. He wanted to shut down our UBB! __________________ Shut down the Bulletin Board? This is the 1st time I have even opened the "off topic" forum. I am quite surprised to see this thread still going. Personally, I think both sides have displayed pretty good thoughts(except for the down in the muck part...j/k). Can't we all just get along? PS: now I don't think I will post anymore...don't want to lose my number [This message has been edited by Realrammstein (edited 07-11-2000).] __________________ quote: Originally posted by AJ: Come on, man. You have a bunch of posts, your not new, you can't do that just to get attention. It will get moved there, and you lose respect for you post- it looks like you don't know what you're doing. If everyone felt their post was too important, like you, then the boards would be a mess... I understand your point, AJ, though I assure you I know what I'm doing. I'm certainly not a moderator like Apex or Leon, and I don't aspire to be one, but similar posts regarding attitude in the Deals forum had been posted in the past, and I considered the problem important enough to address in a similar fashion. This post is, now, in the Off Topic forum, where people like you will read it because you frequent this board, but some will not. I wanted the people that were involved - those in the Deals forum - to read this any take what they wished from it as well. __________________ quote: Originally posted by vudoo: I think if a post gets out of hand it should be locked and moved to the off topic forum. Where it can be continued until everyone involved is satisfied. As for the comment you made about just skipping over the threads you don't like. Well you should take your own advice and skip over the threads that you do not think you want to read. I can't see how you can tell us to skip over threads while you aren't doing the same. Vudoo - What I was saying is that if you're not interested in the subject line of a message, then just skip over it. I was interested in that hard drive, so I did open it and read it. After reading it, I felt disappointed enough to respond. When I see something I'm not interested it (like the recent topic "Free Guster Show in Fort Worth"), I do skip it. I don't live remotely close to Fort Worth nor am I the least big interested in Guster. I do follow my own advice, thank you vudoo. __________________ quote: Originally posted by pennypinch: Ben: I must also take exception with some of your remarks. I, myself, have made some very off-colour remarks in haste, and was appropriately taken to task by Ugly and friends; many a time, what can be construed as something mean-spirited or "hateful" (a word bandied about all too often on these boards, along with "scam"!) is either a) a joke in poor taste or b) a sometimes misguided, sometimes not, attempt to protect these very boards we all love. In fact, some of my "retard" posts were in that very vein: people using e-bay style caps lock titles for deal requests. Hey, let's admit I didn't exaclty use the best terminology for the people I was targeting...but it rankled me, and I have just as much right to express that emotion as you have to not read it. Pennypinch - I would never want to infringe or stifle your rights. If anyone were to tell me that I wasn't allowed to express my opinions any more, I would very much have a problem with that. Right now, I'm expressing my opinion. My opinion is that however "rankled" you get, a well-thought-through post is a lot more effective and worthy of your peers' respect than a retard post. Some of the replies to that original message were just brief, uncapitalized, unpunctuated low blows that clearly show that the authors have sunk themselves down right to his level. My intent is not to appear that I am on a higher level than anyone, but only to say that if you feel so strongly about protecting your board, then show that rather than just lashing out. __________________ quote: Originally posted by Ben_Williams: I'm not aiming my message at people who clearly think things through and then post a message; and my intent was not to say that those message belonged elsewhere, because that would be hypocritical. What I'm asking to stop is the childish insults and rude comment that have become pervasive as of late. When people take issue to something, and sit down and write a carefully constructed reply, then I commend them, regardless of their stance. However, when people take issue to something and quickly jot down some silly and quickly constructed reply, I have to object. -Ben Well...it would be somewhat flippant for me to point out that by commending Rammstien, you've targeted me, and thus labelled me as one who doesn't think through posts! Moreoever, though, I think you are trying to moralize for us. I'll agree with an above post: I was sincerely offended by some of the things that were written in the deleted argument with Vadimr; few of my posts were thoughtless, as far as I remember. And truthfully, please don't tell me whether I can be rude or not. I certainly make an effort to be nice to most people. I get a little short with people ask for deals without expending any effort on their own accord, but so what? I think one of the best things I've taken from this board is that I'm now "deal-sufficient" for the most part: I have a pretty good sense of where to look for things when I want to buy them cheap. Is it too much to ask to direct them to places where they can search on their own? I feel we all exercise the appropriate amount of restraint on this board; always have, and always will. I think some attitudes have changed just because we aren't the tightly knit group of 400 or so; we have people like Homie, 3314, Havok over in the MLM forum, and everyone's favorite consumer advocate, Vadimr assaulting our community. Sometimes to catch the pig, you have to get down in the muck. [This message has been edited by pennypinch (edited 07-11-2000).] __________________ quote: Originally posted by Realrammstein: Shut down the Bulletin Board? This is the 1st time I have even opened the "off topic" forum. I am quite surprised to see this thread still going. Personally, I think both sides have displayed pretty good thoughts(except for the down in the muck part...j/k). Can't we all just get along? PS: now I don't think I will post anymore...don't want to lose my number [This message has been edited by Realrammstein (edited 07-11-2000).] We're getting along! We're just having a discussion. And what do you mean about losing your number? __________________ Hello? 69? Yeah, he was threatening to hack the UBB code such that it "crashes real easy". At least I THINK that's what he said. He was kind of rambling incoherently at times. __________________ quote: Originally posted by pennypinch: Hello? 69? ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, his post number. Ok rammstein, dont post anymore __________________ HAH! I just saw the aforementioned small-HD post! That was actually pretty funny! And a quick search of the forum, Mr. Williams, shows that they were, in fact, spamming the Deals forum. I thought bandito's long reponse was particularly ribald. By the way, I motion to change the term "spam". I happen to like spam. A lot. __________________ quote: Originally posted by Ben_Williams: Vudoo - What I was saying is that if you're not interested in the subject line of a message, then just skip over it. I was interested in that hard drive, so I did open it and read it. After reading it, I felt disappointed enough to respond. When I see something I'm not interested it (like the recent topic "Free Guster Show in Fort Worth"), I do skip it. I don't live remotely close to Fort Worth nor am I the least big interested in Guster. I do follow my own advice, thank you vudoo. Well I said if you don't like the thread then skip over it. That means when you open up a thread and you don't like it just hit the back button and your out of there. Another thing is if you don't like the language used in the thread just say so. 9 out of 10 times you will recieve an apology. Sometime people say things that they don't mean. If you just tell them they will be more than happy to take it back. __________________ quote: Originally posted by vudoo: Well I said if you don't like the thread then skip over it. That means when you open up a thread and you don't like it just hit the back button and your out of there. Another thing is if you don't like the language used in the thread just say so. 9 out of 10 times you will recieve an apology. Sometime people say things that they don't mean. If you just tell them they will be more than happy to take it back. Vudoo, I'm not sure what your argument is here - you seem to be arguing my point against me. I said if you don't like a post, skip it - you said the same thing. You said if I don't like the language of a thread, I should say so, which is what I am doing right now. I'm sorry if I'm misinterpreting your message, but you seem to be telling me exactly what I've already said and done. -Ben __________________ quote: Originally posted by pennypinch: Well...it would be somewhat flippant for me to point out that by commending Rammstien, you've targeted me, and thus labelled me as one who doesn't think through posts! I was targetting all those who posted messages the adhered to the description I have above - if you choose to include yourself in that group, you're more than welcome to. quote: Moreoever, though, I think you are trying to moralize for us. I don't think moralize is the correct word. Civilize, perhaps, would be more appropriate, though priggish and stuck up on my part. If you were to post a well-written message on the upsides to cannibalism, or the value of one-night-stands over a fufilling relationship, I wouldn't agree with you, and I might think you immoral, but I wouldn't try to "moralize" you. Since you made a valid and well written argument for your side, I would simply argue my side back. You can be as immoral as you want (according to the Bible, I'm an immoral abomination several times over), I just ask that in any message, regardless of content, you think through what you want to say. Again, I'm not targetting you specifically, and "you" refers to anyone to which this applies. quote: I'll agree with an above post: I was sincerely offended by some of the things that were written in the deleted argument with Vadimr; few of my posts were thoughtless, as far as I remember. And truthfully, please don't tell me whether I can be rude or not. Now I will direct something at you - in a reply to your message, I specifically said that I would never want to infringe or stifle your rights, including the right to be as rude as you please. I am not an all-mighty dictator instructing you and what you will and will not do. I'm suggesting an alternate way of doing things, nothing more. quote: I certainly make an effort to be nice to most people. I get a little short with people ask for deals without expending any effort on their own accord, but so what? I think one of the best things I've taken from this board is that I'm now "deal-sufficient" for the most part: I have a pretty good sense of where to look for things when I want to buy them cheap. Is it too much to ask to direct them to places where they can search on their own? Direct someone somewhere? No. Insult, belittle, and mock unnecessarily? In my mind, yes. quote: I feel we all exercise the appropriate amount of restraint on this board; always have, and always will. And that's where our opinions differ. I feel that if people exercised the appropriate amount of restraint, we would not see the words I've mentioned as being reminiscent of a middle-school playground floating around the on the board that by your own words is so dear to you. quote: I think some attitudes have changed just because we aren't the tightly knit group of 400 or so; we have people like Homie, 3314, Havok over in the MLM forum, and everyone's favorite consumer advocate, Vadimr assaulting our community. Sometimes to catch the pig, you have to get down in the muck. While that may be valid in catching pigs, I really disagree on it being applied to a civilized argument (something that I see here, but not in the aforementioned topics). -Ben (ed: Fixed UBB quote bracket mistake) [This message has been edited by Ben_Williams (edited 07-11-2000). Mavi forum